dodge – an amazing run

My Search For American Muscle – Part IX

PART IX – Interesting Hemi Dodge Coronet R/T

I’m still looking for a classic car, and I am just a picky as ever. I saw this 1967 Dodge Coronet R/T Hemi car pop up for sale on an auction site and got really excited.

A very nice Hemi-powered 1967 Dodge Coronet R/T in a cool turquoise color. It looks like it won a couple national awards, too.

The auction site listed the car as “no reserve” and with an estimated selling price of $50,000 to $60,000. That is a steal for a Hemi-powered original car. The car was being auctioned online only and was in Indiana, so I was very interested.

Then I started looking at the pictures with the discerning eye that I have developed on this car hunt journey. First thing I noticed was this VIN tag:

fullsizeoutput_13d2a — I’ve looked at numerous pictures of Mopar VINs from 1967 and this one doesn’t look similar. The black paint is not very clean and the rivets aren’t the correct shape. Plus there are no Chrysler Corp. markings anywhere. The number does decode to a Dodge Coronet R/T with a Hemi engine.

As a reference, here’s a real 1967 Hemi Dodge Coronet R/T VIN plate. I suspect that the top one is a fake.

Then there was a picture of the fender tag of the car:

This fender tag decodes correctly to a Hemi-powered 1967 Dodge Coronet R/T as best as I can tell.

The fender tag seems correct for the car as presented, but I see a red flag. My main issue with it is that it is somewhat weathered and worn. This car is pretty well restored and the fender tag looks like it sat outside for thirty or more years. Seeing that the tag is screwed on, which is how they were attached, it can be removed quite easily from one car and reapplied to another. It is correctly stamped for a Dodge Coronet R/T (WS23) with black interior (P6X) and turquoise paint (LL1). I can’t dismiss it as not being the real-deal yet, however.

Then there was this picture of the Certicard:

Certicard’s were Chrysler cards that were used for warranty information that could be swiped for records purposes. They were kept in a plastic sleeve usually in the engine compartment on the firewall of the car.

This is a major red flag. The vehicle identification number (WP41G…) doesn’t match this car at all. It decodes as – W=Dodge Coronet, P=Premium, 41=Four door sedan, G=383 2-barrel engine. All of this is wrong for the car listed for auction. But… this card could have been from another car and just is along for the ride with this one. Maybe someone mixed up the cards? I don’t know, but I am sure I’m not gambling $50,000 on this car being the real deal.

Knowing all of that I now suspect that the car was originally most likely a 1967 Dodge Coronet 500, that had been cloned into a Coronet R/T with a Hemi engine. It was a very good clone though. The correct 150 mph speedometer was present, as was the bucket seats and console, and painted the correct trim and exterior colors that appear on the fender tag. I’m just not buying that it is real. What is a little puzzling to me is that it won two AACA awards. Those judges know a heck of a lot more than I do about the originality of these cars and they still gave it a thumbs up.

I kept an eye on the auction and saw that the bidding was pretty slow and was in the $30,000 to $40,000 range for a few days. It finally sold for $50,000. The current market value for a real Hemi-powered version of this car would be closer to $90,000 or more. Someone got a really nice but possibly cloned Hemi-powered Dodge Coronet R/T to drive around. I just hope that they know that it may not be the real deal.

My Search For American Muscle – Part VI

PART VI – GETTING TAKEN FOR A RIDE

Buckle up for another rough ride. I’m pumping the brakes again.

I was excited to find another 1967 Mopar B body convertible for sale on Hemmings the other day. This one is a Dodge Coronet R/T and it looked awesome, light blue with a white top and white interior, and riding on period-correct redline tires. This car was being sold by a Dodge dealership in Sioux City, Iowa and I clicked on an inquiry tab and asked about the car. A salesperson got back to me really quick, and I was getting that feeling you get when you go to a dealership to kick some tires and get the “buy it now” pressure pitch. I could almost picture her wearing a plaid jacket and white dress shoes. I was trickling blood in the water, and the shark had sensed it.

67009867-770-0@2X.jpg — A recently listed light blue 1967 Dodge Coronet R/T convertible.

The car was described as being a favorite of the dealership owner, kept at his house and that he personally enjoys driving it. It was listed for nearly $50,000, which is a little higher than what I have seen a few of them sell for. I let her know that I was interested, but I had to consider taxes and shipping, and that the asking price was pushing me over budget with all of that. She inquired as to where I lived and advised that I would pay taxes in my state. Then she offered the car for $49,000 with shipping. That’s still pretty high for me, but it was in line with what these cars typically sell for. I was interested for sure.

After that sales pitch, I advised her that I was reluctant to buy a 50+-year-old car without seeing it run or at least a video of it. The website had a short video, but there was no sound and the car wasn’t moving. I asked if there was a video of it driving and she provided this:

Lots of wind noise, but it runs and drives. Did you notice anything different about the car? It was the first thing I noticed as soon as it came into view. The dealership removed the period correct and totally awesome redline tires and replaced them with white walls. Not a deal killer for me, but I dig that redline tire/Hot Wheels look.

Since there are only so many of these cars available out there, I decided to see if I could dig up any history or information on this one. I Googled the VIN and got only two hits. And the first one was an a-ha moment. I had seen this car for sale before.

When I peruse the Hemmings classifieds I usually skip over the cars listed for auction, as I am just not familiar with buying a car at auction. There are rules and hidden costs involved, and if you aren’t able to be there in person to see the car you have to rely on just a description. Plus you still have to get the dumb thing home somehow. But I do look at the listings of the cars that I am interested in, especially the ’67 B bodies. This particular car had been listed on Hemmings about 4 months ago as part of a Mecum auction listing. Here is a photo from that listing:

The car hit the auction block in the Phoenix area in March 2019 at no reserve and sold for $35,000 plus a 10% commission, for a grand total of $38,500.

MecumPhoenix2019_IMG5335_F111_Dodge_1967_Coronet_Convertible_WS27L77177284__900.jpg — No reserve on this car and the buyer stole it.

The other Google hit was for a website called Rick Carey’s Collector Car Auction Reports, and it provided a ton of insight into the car:

“Restored and clean underneath. Redone to appropriate standards for what it is, but done on a budget and indifferently presented with some age and a few miles since the restoration. – The Glendale bidders clearly saw this Coronet for what it is and priced it appropriately for its weekend driver condition.”

Mr. Carey thought that this car sold well for $38,500 and that the new owner will enjoy his weekend driver.

So how does this Coronet go from being recently required 3-4 months ago, to being a “favorite of the owner who loves to drive it,” to being turned around and offered for sale at a markup of $11000?! I think the reason the owner “loves” it is because he’s trying to flip it, and he stands to make quite a profit. This was not settling well with me.

Now this happens all the time, and I get it. The Olds 442 I drove last year had a price of $45K and after I passed on it, I found it for sale in Ohio for $55K. This owner runs a new car dealership, selling classic cars on the side, and is in the business of making a profit on those great deals he finds. Truthfully the car isn’t really priced out of what the actual value is. My last post about losing out on another one of these cars, almost identical to this one, sold for $48000. So it’s a fair listing price. It’s just that he stands to make a huge profit, and I’m not sure I’m the one that wants to please him in that way.

I decided to reply with what I now know about the car and offered a low ball offer, an offer in which he still stands to make a profit, but just about half of what he was looking for. His salesperson rep wasn’t having it. She came back with what she offered before -$49K and delivery to my driveway. I’m mulling it over.

I’m looking to take a ride in a classic car, not be taken for a ride.

My Search For American Muscle – Part III

Hey everyone! It has been a while since I thrilled you with my search for a classic car, so let’s return to another edition! (If you need to get up to speed, you can read my previous posts at the links at the bottom.)

PART III – Why I Suck At Buying A Muscle Car

This was supposed to be fun. This could have been simple. Find a car you like. Contact the seller. Pay some money. Get a car. Nope.

Back in November of last year I got excited about a 1967 Olds 442 that I wrote about in Part I, and I rushed up to the northern Chicago suburbs to take a look at the car, test drove it, almost reached into my back pocket for the checkbook, and then hit the brakes. I just had a bad feeling. I felt like I was rushing into it too fast, and that I was buying on adrenaline fueled impulse. The adult in me told me to take a pass and make sure I knew what I was doing. I kind of regret that. That car was pretty good, it was priced well, and the wife and I would have looked great in it cruising around town on the weekends. That car is gone, and I needed to move on.

And move on I did, onto a 1967 Plymouth Belvedere GTX convertible located in sunny Los Angeles, California.

1967-plymouth-gtx-1 — ’67 GTX in Turbine Bronze Metallic!

This car looked great in the pictures online and I was hooked – hooked in the same way I was with the 442. I think part of my problem is that these cars are pretty rare. You could argue that the market for old muscle cars is plentiful, and there are plenty, but there just are not that many 1967 Plymouth GTX convertibles in turbine bronze metallic paint with white on black interiors. Trust me on that one. It’s not like you can go down to the local Plymouth dealership and place an order for one like they did in 1967. (Plymouth doesn’t even exist anymore, so there’s that too.) So when a cool optioned car becomes available, you kind of need to act on it if you want it. But with the 442 lesson learned I decided to wait. In late December we were going to be in Pasadena for the Tournament of Roses Parade with my daughter’s marching band. I had the great idea that since we would be in SoCal for the parade, I would take a ride to Chatsworth, CA and take a look at the car. But the trip was already pretty heavily planned out, and I had to take a pass on seeing the GTX.

I wrote in Part II of my search that I had done a little more digging into the history of the GTX and found out some things about the car that gave me a little pause, mainly it’s history of being auctioned three times, and that it had been in Virginia and Florida when the dealership was advising that it was an Arizona/New Mexico car. But that didn’t really deter me, so I kept a close eye on it.

I was kind of sitting in the midwest in the middle of the typical winter polar vortex, and I came to the conclusion that trying to buy a car and have it shipped here in this weather was a bad idea. But a few weeks passed and we moved into February and eventually I decided that I liked the idea of owning that car enough that I should either book another flight to California to see it myself, or have someone go look at it for me. Guess what, there are people who are experts at classic cars (i.e. the opposite of me) that you can pay to inspect it for you! I finally contacted one that I thought was trustworthy and was told that for my $400 I would get a detailed inspection of the car with an awesome report and tons of pictures. All I wanted him to do really was to drive the thing and give me a thumbs up or thumbs down, but what he was offering to do was cool too. So I contacted the dealer and told him I was going to send this guy over to look at the GTX and got the following email reply:

Hi Chris,

Thanks for reaching out.

The 67 has sold.

I have a 68 Hemi Coupe and a few other cars that I will be happy to have inspected.

All the best.

Bummer dude. That’s a real drag, man. He had the gall to suggest I buy a 68 Hemi Coupe. A Hemi. A HEMI WITH AN $80,000 PRICE TAG. Sir, you mistake me for a Rockefeller. And if I am heading into the year 1968, I’m buying a Road Runner, not a GTX. They are basically the same, but the Road Runner is much cooler. (I may regret that statement. Okay, I already do.)

Okay, the car is gone. Actually the second of two cars that had me drooling are gone! What the heck? I suck at this! Turns out being patient and making sure I was making the right purchase was dumb too! Buy on impulse = bad idea. Wait and make sure it’s the right one = also bad. I am really bad at this!

But I am learning, and I will keep looking. Here are some cars that are on my current wish list, that I am sure I will not be owning any time soon:

63917270-770-0@2X — A 1968 Olds 442 convertible in green that looks pretty good, but is located in Maine and the dealer says the A/C isn’t working. On my gotta have it scale it is a 6/10.

65110156-770-0@2X — Next up is a 1970 Olds 442, which is priced way below market value for some reason. Could it be the Chevy emblem on the crankcase breather element? The dash that has no vent holes? Hmmm… Positives are it looks pretty decent, is located about 1.5 hours from me, it’s a 4-speed, and it’s painted gold with a black interior. Looks nice. Cons are it may not be original, and it looks like it sports a kinda okay restoration. It’s a 5/10 on the scale for me.

1967-plymouth-gtx — Here’s another GTX that’s within a couple hour drive for me. I really like this one. It’s much cheaper than the one I lost out on, but it isn’t pristine. Looks pretty good though. It has an aftermarket A/C that I am not sure I’m down with as the original Plymouth climate control levers were replaced with different knobs from the aftermarket unit. I’d give this car a 7/10.

58639268-770-0@2X — Next up is a 1967 Dodge Coronet R/T. The Dodge Coronet and the Plymouth Belvedere were practically the same car. They even rolled off the assembly line in St. Louis together. This thing has got me excited like the California GTX did. Apparently it was owned by a Vietnam vet who traded in a 60’s Corvette for this when he came back home. I looked into the guy and it turns out he passed away. In his obituary, a buddy of his recalls a proud time when they rode in the Coronet on a trip somewhere. I dig that history. The car is in Ohio, which isn’t that far and may be worth a weekend trip for me. It does have a small visible paint chip on the front right fender, but the rest of the car is clean. 9/10 on the want it now scale!

65386504-770-0@2X — Guess what I found? Another 1967 Dodge Coronet R/T convertible! This one in Deep Blue Metallic paint. The big highlight for this car is that it’s a 4-speed. The downside is that it’s mid-80’s restoration is showing a little wear, and it’s in Minnesota. But it’s still a big like from me. I’d give it 9/10 for sure.

There are a few others I am following, but I won’t bore you with those for now. I’ll save them for the next blog when I write about missing out on the cars above. For now, I will keep kicking those internet tires and keep my hopes up for finding one that has my name on it.

Here are the links to the previous posts:

My Search For American Muscle – Part I

My Search For American Muscle – Part II